Display:


Re: Heads in the Sand (1.25 / 4)

it's a tie, she's ahead in the popular vote that the entire point of the super's is to pick the one that can best win. I don't think Barack can win, but if he's the nom I'll be holding my fingers and hoping. He hasn't the judgment, too many gaffs. just today when he heard of Senator Kennedy's hospitalization he made a statement that sounded like he knew the man is dead already "He WAS one of my favorite people."  Has he no advisors at all? She made the appropriate one: "My thoughts and prayers are with Sen. Ted Kennedy and his family today.  We all wish him well and a quick recovery."

How hard is that?  


by anna shane on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:11:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 2)

1. She's not ahead in the popular vote.

2. This is a delegate race, not a PV race.

3. The superdelegates are picking the one that can best win.

4. That's why the superdelegates are endorsing Obama at a >10 to 1 ratio.


should we go outside? / should we break some bread? / are you'nterested?
by Firewall on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:13:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 0)

They are (apparently) Picking the one that they THINK will be mostly likely to win. Or possilby simply just jumping on a bandwagon or trying to avoid a longer primary. Remember superdelgedates aren't possessed with special powers that enable them to pick presidential winners correctly. THey gave us Mondale in 84, for example. Many of them are the same people from back then too.


by Mayor McCheese on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:23:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 2)

since they haven't rushed en masse to Barack, giving him a certain victory, what do you think they're waiting for? Many who haven't endorsed are in congress, and they want to win their seats back.  many of their small town constituents voted for hillary and poll far less favorably for Barack. Are they supposed to turn against their own voters to go for a guy who is less prepared, and has a reduced chance of winning the GE?  Well, it's rhetorical, we'll all see soon enough.  How long until Denver?  In this case the Dem's have an advantage over pug districts, they've been elected by Democrats and they represent Democrats, not indies or left-leaning libertarians.  She's got the Reagan Dem's with her, that's a big loss for him, he praised Reagan and wrongly predicted they'd go with him in a landslide that would give him a mandate. he's already proven wrong, how much wronger does he need to prove himself to be?  


by anna shane on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:31:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 1)

Sorry, but do you ever stop and read what you're writing. Half the time I don't even understand what you're wrighting. Take a breath before you start, already.


"In the primary you should vote with your heart, but in the general, you should vote with your head" Bill Clinton
by venician on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:34:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 1)

stop the charm, I'm getting pulled to Barack by the force of your charm.  


by anna shane on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:38:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (none / 0)

I don't think you understand what a "reagan democrat is".  At least judging by your last statement, and a rather silly statement you made before that Hillary Clinton had won Reagan democrats - a feat that "not even Bill Clinton" had done.

Here: "Reagan democrats" are what the media likes to call ethnic working class whites.  It's not an ideology - it's a demographic.


We should be able to deliver bottled hot water to dehydrated babies.
by Jess81 on Sat May 17, 2008 at 03:26:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 2)

Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama, beginning a tour of hospitals in Eugene, Ore., told reporters that he had been in touch with the senator's family. "Ted Kennedy is a giant in American political history. He's done more for health care than just about anybody in history. We are going to be rooting for him. I insist on being optimistic about how it's going to turn out."

My source is here - where's yours from?


by upstate girl on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:14:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Hillaryland (2.00 / 1)

'tis a magical place.


by JJE on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:23:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (1.00 / 1)

first statement vs. someone had a word with him?  


by anna shane on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:36:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 1)

I'm sure you have some kind of source to back your accusation up, is all I'm saying...don't you?

Or are you making things up again?


by upstate girl on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:38:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (none / 0)

actually anna, you're taking a horrible snark attempt by susanhu made at No Quarter and passing it off like its true. She doesn't have a source either. Grow up, anna.


by upstate girl on Sat May 17, 2008 at 04:21:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 2)

You usually make more or less rational arguments, but not this time.  If you really think Obama response to Ted Kennedy's seizure then you are now in straw grasping territory.  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:17:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 2)

I'd appreciate a link to his statement where he refers to Ted Kennedy in the past tense.

Thanks.


by Pat Flatley on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:18:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 2)

I'd like to see the link also. It's all partisan now, isn't it? Unfortunately, it is intra party now.


by futbol dad on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:18:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

anna shame... (2.00 / 2)

That's really low, trying to make a political scandal out of that.


"I'm all for the delegate battle, and now that Obama's campaign is too, I'm all giddy. It's going to be the supers as kingmaker." J.Armstrong 01/19/08
by obscurant on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:24:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 2)

You stay classy, anna shane.


by amiches on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:29:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (1.33 / 3)

I thought it was funny. It's true, I didn't make it up.


by anna shane on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:39:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 1)

Yet you can't cite a source on it.


by upstate girl on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:40:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (1.00 / 2)

can't?  Silly you?  


by anna shane on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:52:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 2)

Either you can't or you won't. If you can't, your accusation is false. If you won't, its still false and you're fully aware you're lying. Which is it, anna?


by upstate girl on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:53:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 1)

This is pathetic, even by your standards.  Cite a source to back up your absurd quote or retract it.



Lost rate and rec for issuing a '1' to a trollish comment. The troll, not so much.

by map on Sat May 17, 2008 at 03:00:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (1.00 / 2)

trying to bully me? Go to No Quarter, or google it.  


by anna shane on Sat May 17, 2008 at 03:49:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 1)

Oh, anna. I just did.

2 results. Your source on No Quarter is Susanhu. And she doesn't have a source either. She made a sarcastic comment and you fell for it, and more so, you tried to pass it off as the truth.

The only other source for that phrase in conjunction with Obama and Kennedy is another blog calling her out on taking a ludicrous low blow at Obama using Kennedy's medical emergency as a foil.

You're a fool, or a troll.


by upstate girl on Sat May 17, 2008 at 03:57:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 1)

And since you knew providing a link to this was going to prove your insincerity, I'll provide it for you:

Google  search

Susanhu's sad little hitjob on No Quarter


by upstate girl on Sat May 17, 2008 at 03:59:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (none / 0)

Right, anna shane.  I was just engaging in sexist bullying.  It had nothing to do with you spreading lies.

Oh, and thanks to upstate girl for proving you were spreading lies.



Lost rate and rec for issuing a '1' to a trollish comment. The troll, not so much.

by map on Sat May 17, 2008 at 04:22:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (none / 0)

Wow. I used to count you as a somewhat reasonable Hillbot. No more.


by amiches on Sat May 17, 2008 at 04:35:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (none / 0)

It's not a tie at all.  By every measure that counts all voters, Barack Obama is ahead in the popular vote, and more importantly for the process of the nomination, he's virtually clinched the pledged delegate count even with FL and MI.  There is no fair metric that shows Hillary Clinton in any kind of lead at all.


Join the Matthew 25 Network and help Democrats win the next generation of evangelicals.
by mistersite on Sat May 17, 2008 at 02:52:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (2.00 / 1)

that's the spin, but I'm not buying it. In certified votes she's ahead by about 50,000, not a lot, but sure to grow with kentucky. Nice diary, eh?  


by anna shane on Sat May 17, 2008 at 03:50:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (none / 0)

Why are you abusing the rating system in many diaries??


Obama supporter who is damn glad Hillary Clinton is a Democrat!!
by hootie4170 on Sat May 17, 2008 at 03:58:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (none / 0)

That's the problem: certified votes are meaningless when so many states have different ways of counting the vote and deciding their nomination.  Whether that's fair or right isn't the question here; the fact is that they do, and certified votes alone leave a great deal to be desired.

There are two main problems with going only by certified votes:

  1. Certified votes don't count four caucus states; do you want to disenfranchise them by not counting them in the popular vote total?  That seems to fly in the face of the (since Feb 6) Clintonian notion that Florida and Michigan must be counted.  Why shouldn't voters in WA, ME, IA, and NV be counted?  Do their votes not matter as much as those in MI and FL?
  2. Certified votes give Obama zero in the state of Michigan.  True, he took his name off the ballot out of respect for the pledge he and the other candidates signed that said they wouldn't participate in the MI primary, but nevertheless, there is nobody who seriously suggests that he has zero supporters in that state.  To be fair, at least some, if not all, of Michigan's uncommitted votes should be counted into Obama's total.  This would erase her 30,000 vote "lead" (according to RCP, not counting WA, IA, ME, or NV) and acknowledge his actual lead in the primary votes.
  3. Whether or not you count certified votes or actual votes, the fact of the matter is that the superdelegates, being as they are professional political actors in one way or another, are well aware of the two problems with the certified vote count above.  This means that no matter how much you may make the case that only the certified vote count should matter, they know better than to make a decision based on an underestimate of Obama's support.  This is made evident by the fact that Obama continues to pick up superdelegates day by day, while Clinton does not.


Join the Matthew 25 Network and help Democrats win the next generation of evangelicals.
by mistersite on Sat May 17, 2008 at 04:11:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heads in the Sand (none / 0)

I said "two main reasons" and added the third in.  That preview button is there for a reason.


Join the Matthew 25 Network and help Democrats win the next generation of evangelicals.
by mistersite on Sat May 17, 2008 at 04:11:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]